Replacing Kitchen Gfci With Gfci Breakers-something's Not Right
Hi all, this is my first post, so...my kitchen was just renovated and the electrical outlets are on the walls and I wanted them in plugmold under the cabinet. Why didn't it happen? Long story, but I'm doing it myself now. The electrical receptacles are on 2 separate circuits with a gfci receptacle on each and neither circuit has a receptacle outside the kitchen where I can put the gfci's, so I'm putting gfci breakers in the panel instead. I've run into a different problem on each circuit that'd like some advice on.
Circuit 1: this is a 20 amp circuit. I have to plug this circuit's neutral wire into the gfci breaker, but I couldn't see which neutral wire matched the hot wire (buried in mess of wires) and I don't have a continuity tester so I just pulled one neutral at a time (tedious) until the circuit failed, but it never failed. So I did this again for every neutral...same result. This circuit shares a few boxes with other circuits so I'm wondering if the neutrals on different circuits are tied together somewhere, and if so I'm pretty sure, but not completely, that that's not going to work with the gfci breaker. So I didn't install that gfci breaker since I'm not confident it would actually gfci (yep i verbified gfci). What do you think? Circuit 2: this is a 20 amp circuit. This circuit currently has the refrigerator, gas stove and range hood, and then a gfci in front of 3 electrical receptacles, which already sounds bad since I thought the kitchen receptacles required 2 dedicated circuits. I replaced that breaker with no problem, but it tripped after a few minutes and continued to trip every few minutes. I haven't changed anything else on that circuit yet and it's never tripped before, but now it is, so I put the old breaker back for now. The current gfci receptacle is only protecting the 3 outlets since the appliances are ahead of it. I know you wouldn't normally want the appliances gfci protected, so do you think the refrigerator motor may be a problem? Do I need the appliances on a separate circuit? What would you suggest I do? Thanks, and if you're wondering "why all the effort?", it's partly because I'm meddlesome, partly because I'm bored, and partly because the backsplash tile is to be on showcase, not the electrical receptacles. Similar Tutorials
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Hello.
I recently purchased a home that has a a new grounded breaker panel but none of the outlets themselves are grounded save the hvac system in the basement. I had an electrician come and he said the fastest way to get it done is to switch the appropriate breakers to GFCI breakers in my service box and then I can change the outlets and then just put the stickers that say ungrounded etc on the new 3 prong receptacles. he called the inspector to double check and the inspector told him that he can't do it this way but he needs to find the first outlet in the loop from each breaker line and change that receptacle to a gfci and then we can change each receptacle to 3 prong in that loop. Wouldn't just changing the breaker do the same thing? also if I did just install a Gfci receptacle on the first outlet in the loop, if it breaks wouldn't the rest of the outlets behind that gfci not function until I replaced the Gfci outlet where as a breaker would just pop and I can simply go turn it back on? Just wanted to get some opinion from the experts as I'm willing to spend more on doing gfci breakers and am confused as to why the inspector suggested the way he did Thanks for any help!
We are just beginning to start with our kitchen remodel. Today, I mapped out all the circuits and this is what I found.
Circuit # 7 - 20 amp circuit to 1 back splash outlet then to 3 kitchen wall outlets, then to a closet outlet and closet ceiling light and then to a side porch light! Circuit # 8 - 20 amp to Dishwasher and Disposal Circuit # 9 - 20 amp circuit to microwave and kitchen ceiling lights. 2 patio recessed lights and dining room ceiling light. Circuit # 12 - 20 amp circuit to another back splash outlet then to 2 dining room wall outlets. Circuit # 14 - 20 amp to Refrigerator only Circuit # 18 - 15 amp to GFCI outlet in garage then that feeds 3 outlets for 3 bathroom outlets and 1 outside patio outlet. I going to have to add 1 more back splash outlet due to increase in counter space. I'll put the microwave on a dedicated circuit. So I need 2 additional breakers but I only have 1 blank spot in the breaker panel. I guess I can add one of those slim tandem breakers. So my question, is it ok to have additional wall outlets on the same circuit as a back splash outlet? If it's ok I'll lighten up circuit # 7 by putting some of those wall outlets on the additional back splash outlet. Oh, I have 2 20 amp circuits I did not get identified yet! I'll get to those tomorrow. thanks!
That means it applies to the entire country
Permits & Inspections are usually required for ALL electric work It may not be legal for you to do your own work, Check with your local Building Dept This thread will be added onto as a form of "Cliff Notes" for the NEC If there is something that needs to be corrected, or if you wish to add to this thread; please let us know The NEC is available online, you may have to sign up for an account to view it: http://nfpaweb3.gvpi.net/rrserver/br...NFPASTD/7008SB (may not be working) Draft Version: http://www.nfpa.org/assets/files/PDF...08ROPDraft.pdf Also a link to State specific NEC/Building codes: http://bulk.resource.org/codes.gov/ New Code book comes out every 3 years, it is not always fully accepted by States & sometimes not until 1-2 years later Local codes can vary from the NEC 210.23 An individual branch circuit shall be permitted to supply any load for which it is rated (some think you can only load to 80%) 210.50 Required Branch circuits 14g wire is rated for 15a, 12g wire is rated for 20a 15a outlets ONLY on a 15a circuit 15a/20a are allowed on a 20a circuit A single 15a receptacle is not allowed on a 20a circuit AFCI protection is required almost every where under NEC 2008 Exceptions are GFCI required: bathrooms, kitchens, laundry (GFCI if sink within 6' of receptacle), garage & outside circuits Bathroom requires a dedicated 20a GFCI protected circuit that can serve outlets in multiple bathrooms OR Outlets & Lights in One bathroom Kitchen requires 2 dedicated 20a GFCI protected circuits for counter (no lights) Laundry area requires a dedicated 20a GFCI protected circuit . .
I have this cirucit with a GFCI outlet, then two regular outlets off the load. None of them work. The GFCI reset button was out, push it in, it pops back out.
I replaced the GFCI with a new one and it seems to be fine. (GFCI outlet and load outlets are working). Is this common? (I mean that a GFCI would go bad, and display this for behavior?) Thank you, and if this is a stupid question, you may electronically "dope slap" me!
Hi all,
I have two outdoor receptacles that are wired into a junction box in the crawlspace under my house. They are actually ran into a spare bedroom's circuit...therefore not gfi protected. There is a switch above the access (indoors) to the crawlspace that powers these outlets and also light that runs off of the junction point also. Would I be able to replace the switch with a dead front gfci switch to get these outlets protected. Would doing this be safe and up to code? Would I be better off undoing all of the previous owner's work and putting these on a dedicated gfci circuit? House was built in '87 and I am in the US.
Is there any limitation as to how many receptacles can be protected by one GFCI receptacle? For example, can I start the circuit with a GFCI and have another 8 receptacles downstream from it?
I am new to the forum so kindly bear with me. I live in Mesa, AZ and have just had a PEX repipe done to bypass my copper hot water lines. (God don't ask! A real problem here with slab foundations. I already had my kitchen jack hammered once. It is NOT pretty!).
It seems really odd to me that just because it is a dedicated circuit that code would not require that circuit to be GFCI protected. I have a dedicated 20 amp duplex 12 AWG wire outlet under the sink and it is within a few inches of the water lines. The outlet serves a switch for the garbage disposal and serves my dishwasher which is always hot. Now that I have all my maple cabinets pulled out I thought I might change the outlet to a GFCI just to be safe. I have a ground wire, a red wire, a black wire and a white wire. As it is dedicated I think I should use the LINE sided instead of the LOAD side but I am not sure where the wires should go. Could someone give me info on this? It would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.
We just got a used hot tub. It ran fine where we purchased it but since we got it home, it has not run. We installed a new breaker for the hot tub and an GFCI outlet outside. The hot tub inself has a GFCI installed on it. If we plug it into the GFCI outlet it runs for a few seconds and either trips the circuit inside or the hot tub. Is it necessary to have a GFCI outlet outisde if the hot tub has one? We are thinking that this may be our problem..redundancy. Can we install a regular outlet outside instead of the GFCI outlet? When we plug it into a regular outlet it runs. We want to make sure that this is safe before proceeding.
I have a home that I only use from time to time. At Christmas one of the GFCI outlets kept tripping. This outlet has a TV/reciever/cable box/xbox/lights, etc. on the load side. When I reset it, everything would be OK for 20 minutes or so, then it would trip. I did not have time to investigate the problem so I just left it. When I returned a week or so ago, the outlet was tripped and would not reset. As soon as I pushed the reset button in, it would pop back out. I replace the GFCI outlet but that did not help. I removed all load outlets and inspected them. Everything looked OK. Anyone have an idea. The strange thing to me is that the problem seemed to get worse over time. (I.e. it stayed reset for 30 minutes at Christmas and now it will not reset at all). Ideas? Thanks in advance.
Summary of what I'm doing:
Adding 2 outlets for above and below cabinet lighting. Lights are line-level and plug into an outlet. I want to install a single double-rocker switch to control each of these outlets. All of the double rockers I can find are 15-amp. The circuit I am planning to use for power is a 20a. Am I sunk? Will I need to install 2 single 20a switches? I would only put 15a outlets in, obviously, but this doesn't seem like the right way. Are there 20a switches that I just can't seem to find? This is what I'm looking for: One other thing, the circuit I am using for this is GFCI protected. Should the lighting part of this circuit go to the load (to be GFCI protected) or is it advisable to put the lights before the GFCI? |